Discover MakerZone

MATLAB and Simulink resources for Arduino, LEGO, and Raspberry Pi

Learn more

Discover what MATLAB® can do for your career.

Opportunities for recent engineering grads.

Apply Today

Thread Subject:
deployment without administrator rights

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Han Oostdijk

Date: 24 Nov, 2010 08:39:04

Message: 1 of 15

I read the article of Peter Webb in Loren Shure's blog "Loren on the Art of MATLAB" of 18 November 2010. I still have a question related to comment #6 (second part) by Arthur to this article (that was not answered by reading the pdf documentation):

If deployment to a customer means that administrator rights for his/her machine are needed, then it makes no sense for me to acquire the Compiler.

Therefore my questions:
Is deployment possible without such rights?
E.g. by just copying directories for development machine to customer machine and letting the customer start the application with a batch file that sets paths to the copied directories?

Thanks in advance for your feedback,

Han

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: ImageAnalyst

Date: 24 Nov, 2010 14:33:27

Message: 2 of 15

Just copying your files over shouldn't require admin privileges, but
installing the MCR might - I'm not sure.

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Han Oostdijk

Date: 24 Nov, 2010 21:22:06

Message: 3 of 15

ImageAnalyst <imageanalyst@mailinator.com> wrote in message <f879790d-e9c6-4e78-8f21-8f74c3ded1aa@r29g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>...
> Just copying your files over shouldn't require admin privileges, but
> installing the MCR might - I'm not sure.

Yes, but do I need to 'install' the MCR on the customer's machine?
Is it not sufficient to copy the deployed (exe) file and the MCR files to a directory of the customer?

Han

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: ImageAnalyst

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 00:02:48

Message: 4 of 15

On Nov 24, 4:22 pm, "Han Oostdijk" <han.remove.oostd...@euronet.nl>
wrote:
> Yes, but do I need to 'install' the MCR on the customer's machine?
> Is it not sufficient to copy the deployed (exe) file and the MCR files to a directory of the customer?
>
> Han
---------------------------------
I seriously doubt it. And where would you get the MCR files? From
another computer that *did* have it installed? I doubt that would
work. I think you'll have to get the computer admin to install it.
Is there a problem with that? Surely there must be someone around
with admin rights to the computer.

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Han Oostdijk

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 12:19:05

Message: 5 of 15

ImageAnalyst <imageanalyst@mailinator.com> wrote in message <eee1990e-98e4-4397-9dae-365967ef0877@z19g2000yqb.googlegroups.com>...
> On Nov 24, 4:22 pm, "Han Oostdijk" <han.remove.oostd...@euronet.nl>
> wrote:
> > Yes, but do I need to 'install' the MCR on the customer's machine?
> > Is it not sufficient to copy the deployed (exe) file and the MCR files to a directory of the customer?
> >
> > Han
> ---------------------------------
> I seriously doubt it. And where would you get the MCR files? From
> another computer that *did* have it installed? I doubt that would
> work. I think you'll have to get the computer admin to install it.
> Is there a problem with that? Surely there must be someone around
> with admin rights to the computer.

ImageAnalyst,

thanks for your response.
I would like to following scenario to work.
- I buy the MATLAB compiler
- and build an application on my development machine
- and deploy (and install the MCR) on my test machine where I have all (administrator) rights
- from my testmachine I copy the deployed application and the MCR files to directories in the machine of the customer (with similar operating system)
- I create a batch file on the machine of the customer where I set paths to the directories and call the deployed executable

Of course there can be reasons why this would not work, but until now I have not heard any.

I know I can request a trial version and just try, but I think someone might be able to answer the questions from own experience.

In my experience you should avoid applications that need admin rights as much as possible. While the actual install only takes seconds, in some organisations the administration around 'changes' can take months.
Good to hear that you have no problems in such cases!

Regards Han.

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Bruno Luong

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 12:44:05

Message: 6 of 15

The administration right is required to install the MCR because it changes the PATH and REGISTRER among other things. The MCR needs to be installed once on the machine.

However if you upgrade the Matlab code, there is no need the reinstall the MCR and no administration is required.

It is normal to expect new installed software to have access to administration right (same thing for Office, Windows, etc)...

The IT guys just have to carry out the work they suppose to do. You should complain if they don't.

Matlab compiler application deployment procedure is not too restrictive IMO.

Bruno

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Han Oostdijk

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 13:29:06

Message: 7 of 15

"Bruno Luong" <b.luong@fogale.findmycountry> wrote in message <icllml$m6t$1@fred.mathworks.com>...
> The administration right is required to install the MCR because it changes the PATH and REGISTRER among other things. The MCR needs to be installed once on the machine.
>
> However if you upgrade the Matlab code, there is no need the reinstall the MCR and no administration is required.
>
> It is normal to expect new installed software to have access to administration right (same thing for Office, Windows, etc)...
>
> The IT guys just have to carry out the work they suppose to do. You should complain if they don't.
>
> Matlab compiler application deployment procedure is not too restrictive IMO.
>
> Bruno

Bruno,

I understand that IF I WANT to install the MCR I need those rights.
However I would like to avoid the install.
The paths that would be set by the install can be set in a batch file.
And I wonder what registry setting(s) would be needed to make use of the runtime MATLAB routines?

Also I wonder if all these registry things are not a sad mistake ;)
And if IT is no longer a technical but an administrative job.

Thanks for your response,

Han

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Bruno Luong

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 14:03:05

Message: 8 of 15

"Han Oostdijk" <han.remove.oostdijk@euronet.nl> wrote in message <iclob2$a9l$1@fred.mathworks.com>...

>
> Also I wonder if all these registry things are not a sad mistake ;)

No. Every software installation should be approved by administrator, and in contrary any administrator guy should install software from user's request.

It's not more complicated than that.

If you someone want out of the rule of game, then they should not complain.

Bruno

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Bruno Luong

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 14:05:05

Message: 9 of 15

"Han Oostdijk" <han.remove.oostdijk@euronet.nl> wrote in message <iclob2$a9l$1@fred.mathworks.com>...

> And if IT is no longer a technical but an administrative job.

If your organization runs like that, it will not last very long.

Bruno

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Aurelien Queffurust

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 14:27:04

Message: 10 of 15

"Han Oostdijk" <han.remove.oostdijk@euronet.nl> wrote in message <iciiv8$2b3$1@fred.mathworks.com>...

> Therefore my questions:
> Is deployment possible without such rights?
> E.g. by just copying directories for development machine to customer machine and letting the customer start the application with a batch file that sets paths to the copied directories?
>
> Thanks in advance for your feedback,
>
> Han


This is the official answer :
How can I install the MATLAB Component Runtime without Administrator rights when using MATLAB Compiler 4.6 (R2007a)?
http://www.mathworks.com/support/solutions/en/data/1-4B6VFA/?solution=1-4B6VFA

Aurélien,
http://blog.developpez.com/matlab4geek/

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Walter Roberson

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 15:24:03

Message: 11 of 15

On 25/11/10 8:03 AM, Bruno Luong wrote:

> No. Every software installation should be approved by administrator, and
> in contrary any administrator guy should install software from user's
> request.
>
> It's not more complicated than that.

I was a system administrator for quite a number of years.

Under Canadian law, the person who installs (or approves) software would
be held *personally* responsible for copyright or licensing violations.
"I did not know we did not have a license" is not a defense for systems
administrators in Canadian law, as it is their duty to know these things.

Likewise, under Canadian law, if a superior gives an order to install
software in violation of copyright or licensing agreements, then the
person who installs it is still legally responsible, under the principle
that a superior cannot legally give an order to do something illegal.
Threats to one's employment (or perceived threats) are not sufficient
defense in Canadian law: the requirement to not do illegal acts
outweighs the inconvenience (however great) of finding a new job.

Similarly, I was the person appointed to be responsible for security,
and with respect to that duty, my chain of command went to headquarters
directly, bypassing the local leadership. One of my responsibilities for
security was to set and enforce policies so that virus and trojan
infections were restricted in their spread and (to the degree practical)
could not steal anything protected by The Official Secrets Act or The
Privacy Act, and The Privacy Act places some kinds of information about
individuals under the controls of The Official Secrets Act. _Someone_
had to be responsible for ensuring that "best practices" were used to
protect the things that were legally "Classified Information", and that
person was me. Installing unknown programs upon demand from the user is
*not* a Best Practice for security!

I agree that some portions of what I did could be considered to be
"administrative" rather than "technical", but an organization is seldom
well-served by having the administrators of technology be people who do
not understand that technology well. Organizations that do not actively
administer their technology run in to many problems, especially if they
are organizations which rely heavily on technology.

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Bruno Luong

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 16:02:04

Message: 12 of 15

Walter, your story is enlightened on the difficult of a system administrator to fulfill his/her duty for various reason, technical as well as legal aspect.

This nobody can deny.

I just merely point out the inconsistency of Han thinks as "sad mistake". The administrator right is established in order for the system administrator to be the only person who could approve (or not) software installation. If the user is free to install whatever software he like, then why setting up the administrator restriction at the first place? There is no logical behind IMO.

Bruno

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Han Oostdijk

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 22:28:03

Message: 13 of 15

Thank you all (ImageAnalyst, Bruno, Walter and Aurélien) for your feedback.

Special thanks to Aurélien for the reference to "the official answer" :
How can I install the MATLAB Component Runtime without Administrator rights when using MATLAB Compiler 4.6 (R2007a)?
http://www.mathworks.com/support/solutions/en/data/1-4B6VFA/?solution=1-4B6VFA
It clearly describes the issues.

My remark 'a sad mistake' was pointed not to administrator rights but to the abundant use of the Windows Registry in general but I now see the connection.
But is not your conclusion (Bruno and Walter) that a responsible software provider should always use registry entries to enforce that the software can only be installed by a system administrator?

Thanks again,
Han

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Bruno Luong

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 22:56:04

Message: 14 of 15

"Han Oostdijk" <han.remove.oostdijk@euronet.nl> wrote in message <icmntj$nd$1@fred.mathworks.com>...

> But is not your conclusion (Bruno and Walter) that a responsible software provider should always use registry entries to enforce that the software can only be installed by a system administrator?
>

To me registry is to keep track what has been installed, which version, what config. The registry is system related. They are there to ensure the compatibility between softwares, libraries, devices, services etc on the same computer OS. Because it's system related, it is understandable that only administrator right can be access to any modification for safety and stability.

I guess (?) the register entries are useful to make sure many Matlab versions, MCRs can coexist and still function seamlessly on the same computer for different users.

It's there for a real purpose, and not for fun.

Yes Windows has created rules, and software providers must follow. Otherwise the computer would become a mess.

If it's an obstacle for the IT guy/gale to take care of the installation, then simply ask the IT guy/gale to give administrator privilege to the user. If not then IT guy/gale is responsible for this sort of things and they have to do what they suppose to do. Period.

Bruno

Subject: deployment without administrator rights

From: Walter Roberson

Date: 25 Nov, 2010 23:30:19

Message: 15 of 15

On 10-11-25 04:28 PM, Han Oostdijk wrote:

> But is not your conclusion (Bruno and Walter) that a responsible
> software provider should always use registry entries to enforce that the
> software can only be installed by a system administrator?

It would not be _my_ conclusion. My experience is that the registry creates
more difficulties than it solves. And I still haven't been able to figure out
why it is common for programs to install hundreds of registry keys.

Give me human-readable configuration files, and programs that can accept
options that tells them which configuration files to use. You might still need
administrator privilege to install a program in a manner that it would be able
to find the default system-wide configuration file, but that should not be
anything special and would not affect running user-land programs "stand-alone"
(or from removable media.)

Tags for this Thread

What are tags?

A tag is like a keyword or category label associated with each thread. Tags make it easier for you to find threads of interest.

Anyone can tag a thread. Tags are public and visible to everyone.

Contact us